Comments on: Second Episodes: Reaper and Chuck http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/ Thoughts on television writing for screenwriters Sun, 07 Sep 2008 19:43:29 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.2 By: admin http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-113 admin Thu, 04 Oct 2007 22:29:05 +0000 http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-113 I loved Reaper on the page and preferred the Chuck pilot. When I watched the second episodes, I liked Reaper better until he refused to open the box for so long. I think Reaper has the better premise and Chuck has the better casting and supporting characters. I think the leads in both shows are great, but Chuck has a better sidekick in Morgan than Sam has in Sock. And they both need great villains and maybe we'll have a show (or two). I loved Reaper on the page and preferred the Chuck pilot. When I watched the second episodes, I liked Reaper better until he refused to open the box for so long.
I think Reaper has the better premise and Chuck has the better casting and supporting characters. I think the leads in both shows are great, but Chuck has a better sidekick in Morgan than Sam has in Sock. And they both need great villains and maybe we’ll have a show (or two).

]]> By: Cunningham (MPB!) http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-112 Cunningham (MPB!) Thu, 04 Oct 2007 22:10:06 +0000 http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-112 I have to say that I'm liking REAPER much more than CHUCK. I still can't get over the hurdle of CHUCK'S premise - that he has all this inteligence inside his head that he can access and link together. The problem with that is all intelligence (data gathering as well as coordinating data) has an extremely short shelf-life. Intelligence changes as more of it comes into play. Are they going to keep downloading info into Chuck? The tag at the end of the show says not - they're building his replacement... But 6 months? By that time all the cockroaches will have crawled into their hidey-holes and disappeared. This is all very slipshod IMO... I have to say that I’m liking REAPER much more than CHUCK. I still can’t get over the hurdle of CHUCK’S premise - that he has all this inteligence inside his head that he can access and link together. The problem with that is all intelligence (data gathering as well as coordinating data) has an extremely short shelf-life. Intelligence changes as more of it comes into play. Are they going to keep downloading info into Chuck? The tag at the end of the show says not - they’re building his replacement…

But 6 months? By that time all the cockroaches will have crawled into their hidey-holes and disappeared.

This is all very slipshod IMO…

]]> By: Muffin MacGuffin http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-111 Muffin MacGuffin Thu, 04 Oct 2007 19:40:43 +0000 http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-111 I definitely agree that too much time was spent on the Sam-rejecting-his-mission plot, but I think there may have been something larger at work here. Right before he captures the electric monster, he tries to reason with him. I think we may see Sam looking for alternate methods of containment, possibly something that will backfire in a big way later. I definitely agree that too much time was spent on the Sam-rejecting-his-mission plot, but I think there may have been something larger at work here. Right before he captures the electric monster, he tries to reason with him. I think we may see Sam looking for alternate methods of containment, possibly something that will backfire in a big way later.

]]> By: admin http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-110 admin Thu, 04 Oct 2007 13:12:49 +0000 http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-110 I think that the who-can-I-trust tension is built into the Chuck premise because we know what Chuck doesn't know -- that Sarah was romantically involved with renegade Bryce Larkin and that CAsey killed him. So no matter how many times they save Chuck, they will always be suspect in viewers' minds. And even if they felt the need to do explore this more, it could have been done in a plot separate from the episode of the week. I think the episode really suffered from lack of story lines. As to refrigerator thoughts: as soon as he got into that helicopter, I thought, he's a video game afficionado, he knows how to fly this thing. I was very disappointed that Sarah had to talk him down and remind him that he could fly it. I wanted to see a little heroism from Chuck. I think that the who-can-I-trust tension is built into the Chuck premise because we know what Chuck doesn’t know — that Sarah was romantically involved with renegade Bryce Larkin and that CAsey killed him. So no matter how many times they save Chuck, they will always be suspect in viewers’ minds. And even if they felt the need to do explore this more, it could have been done in a plot separate from the episode of the week. I think the episode really suffered from lack of story lines.

As to refrigerator thoughts: as soon as he got into that helicopter, I thought, he’s a video game afficionado, he knows how to fly this thing. I was very disappointed that Sarah had to talk him down and remind him that he could fly it. I wanted to see a little heroism from Chuck.

]]> By: Ben S. http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-109 Ben S. Thu, 04 Oct 2007 06:42:46 +0000 http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-109 Um, DMV, not Post Office, but you all knew that. Um, DMV, not Post Office, but you all knew that.

]]> By: Ben S. http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-108 Ben S. Thu, 04 Oct 2007 06:41:18 +0000 http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-108 I understand why the "Chuck" team decided to go with the 'should I trust her or should I not' storyline so quickly. The way that I see it is that they were between a rock and a hard place with that one. If Chuck, Casey, and Sarah go out on a few world saving adventures they're going to end up saving each other's lives multiple times. After they've saved each other's lives a couple of times it's going to be hard for the viewer to believe that personal loyalty wouldn't stop them from killing each other in cold blood unless there is heavy foreshadowing to the opposite. So it makes sense that you need to have the "can I trust them" storyline early. And, sure enough, they've started the foreshadowing that Casey could kill Chuck already, just to keep up that tension. Still, that doesn't forgive how boring and clunky the episode was. The forced plotting (oh, a highly trained NSA agent has never considered deducing a getaway route!) and dues ex machinas (the helicopter flies just like the video game!) stretched credibility too far. I found myself thinking things like, "How did the pal get to the store before with the nano-bot trackers first? Wasn't he at the house when they left?" When I'm having those 'refrigerator thoughts' during the show it's not a good sign. Unless I heard great things about later episodes I'm not coming back to Chuck. Reaper has a tension problem too. A show where, right off the bat, the main character gets just the super weapon he needs to win, lacks a certain drama. They acknowledged this when the toy car got run over, but instead of having Sam figure out a new way to capture the monster, it turned out he never needed the car. Incidentally, was I the only one who was hoping he was going to use the remote control to take the possessed Prius to the Post Office to drop off the evil spirit and then have to explain to his dad why his new car was in Hell? Repear provided just enough chuckles I'll stick around for one more week, but I agree with you. More jokes and monster fights, less angst. I understand why the “Chuck” team decided to go with the ’should I trust her or should I not’ storyline so quickly.

The way that I see it is that they were between a rock and a hard place with that one. If Chuck, Casey, and Sarah go out on a few world saving adventures they’re going to end up saving each other’s lives multiple times. After they’ve saved each other’s lives a couple of times it’s going to be hard for the viewer to believe that personal loyalty wouldn’t stop them from killing each other in cold blood unless there is heavy foreshadowing to the opposite. So it makes sense that you need to have the “can I trust them” storyline early. And, sure enough, they’ve started the foreshadowing that Casey could kill Chuck already, just to keep up that tension.

Still, that doesn’t forgive how boring and clunky the episode was. The forced plotting (oh, a highly trained NSA agent has never considered deducing a getaway route!) and dues ex machinas (the helicopter flies just like the video game!) stretched credibility too far. I found myself thinking things like, “How did the pal get to the store before with the nano-bot trackers first? Wasn’t he at the house when they left?” When I’m having those ‘refrigerator thoughts’ during the show it’s not a good sign.

Unless I heard great things about later episodes I’m not coming back to Chuck.

Reaper has a tension problem too. A show where, right off the bat, the main character gets just the super weapon he needs to win, lacks a certain drama. They acknowledged this when the toy car got run over, but instead of having Sam figure out a new way to capture the monster, it turned out he never needed the car.

Incidentally, was I the only one who was hoping he was going to use the remote control to take the possessed Prius to the Post Office to drop off the evil spirit and then have to explain to his dad why his new car was in Hell?

Repear provided just enough chuckles I’ll stick around for one more week, but I agree with you. More jokes and monster fights, less angst.

]]> By: admin http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-104 admin Wed, 03 Oct 2007 17:05:14 +0000 http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-104 RAE - I don't know what the networks are demanding, but it didn't work for me. And I'm going to fix the Casey typo now. Thanks for the heads up. RAE -

I don’t know what the networks are demanding, but it didn’t work for me. And I’m going to fix the Casey typo now. Thanks for the heads up.

]]> By: wcdixon http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-103 wcdixon Wed, 03 Oct 2007 17:04:20 +0000 http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-103 Great analysis and agree with most points...and have to also agree with Rae in that there is probably an element of the time between shooting of pilot and actually going to series production to factor in here. Fingers crossed for ep 3. Great analysis and agree with most points…and have to also agree with Rae in that there is probably an element of the time between shooting of pilot and actually going to series production to factor in here. Fingers crossed for ep 3.

]]> By: Scott http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-102 Scott Wed, 03 Oct 2007 15:48:46 +0000 http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-102 I thought Chuck's second episode was very poorly written. The back and forth, who's bad and who's evil. The whole episode seemed very weak, and forced. I thought Chuck’s second episode was very poorly written. The back and forth, who’s bad and who’s evil. The whole episode seemed very weak, and forced.

]]> By: Rae http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-101 Rae Wed, 03 Oct 2007 15:45:08 +0000 http://www.jillgolick.com/2007/10/second-episodes-reaper-and-chuck/#comment-101 I had less of a problem with Chuck's rehashing because at least we didn't have too much time for Chuck to really get into Chuck not trusting either Sarah or Casey in the first episode. With Reaper, though, I felt like I was just watching an alternate pilot. Once you face down a fire demon, don't you get over wondering if this is really happening to you and whether you can get out of it? I guess my question for you is whether this is something shows are asked to do? Ken Levine had <a href="http://kenlevine.blogspot.com/2007/10/why-week-two-is-often-weak-two.html" rel="nofollow"> a post today about the second episodes of shows and the various audiences to which they are catering</a> and, as I read your post and realized that this is something I've seen in a few different shows this season, I wondered if it's something networks want more these days or if it's because of the distance when the pilot and the second episode are written? PS: You wrote, "Chuck can still suspect Sarah and Casey and also pursue a romance with Casey..." Was that intentional? Not that there's anything wrong with that. Seeing him pursue a romance with Casey would no doubt be funnier. I had less of a problem with Chuck’s rehashing because at least we didn’t have too much time for Chuck to really get into Chuck not trusting either Sarah or Casey in the first episode. With Reaper, though, I felt like I was just watching an alternate pilot. Once you face down a fire demon, don’t you get over wondering if this is really happening to you and whether you can get out of it?

I guess my question for you is whether this is something shows are asked to do? Ken Levine had
a post today about the second episodes of shows and the various audiences to which they are catering and, as I read your post and realized that this is something I’ve seen in a few different shows this season, I wondered if it’s something networks want more these days or if it’s because of the distance when the pilot and the second episode are written?

PS: You wrote, “Chuck can still suspect Sarah and Casey and also pursue a romance with Casey…” Was that intentional? Not that there’s anything wrong with that. Seeing him pursue a romance with Casey would no doubt be funnier.

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